Brian Hercliff-Proffer:
We can think of it as a separation of that interpersonal connection. Right. But now we have them back on campus in thousands and there’s no way to go, right. They can just poof Harry Potter themselves away. Right. You have to sit in that with them and have to navigate that. And I think that’s, that’s just a really big thing that students, and even us as professionals are having to relearn in engaging in all of this with all of these layers and the topics that we’re bringing up.

Heather Shea:
Welcome to Student Affairs Now, the online learning community for student affairs educators, I’m your host, Heather Shea. Today we are celebrating our one-year anniversary of Student Affairs Now and featuring a panel of our listeners. Student Affairs Now is the premier podcast and learning community for thousands of us who work in alongside or adjacent to the field of higher education and student affairs.

Heather Shea:
We hope you find these conversations make a contribution to the field and are restorative to the profession. We release new episodes every week on Wednesdays. Find us at studentaffairsnow.com on YouTube or anywhere you listen to podcasts. This episode is brought to you by Stylus, visit styluspub.com and use the promo code SANow for 30% off and free shipping today’s episode is also sponsored by Anthology. Learn more about their innovative data-driven platforms to build and foster your campus student engagement experience. Learn more by visiting anthology.com/engage. As I mentioned, I’m your host, Heather Shea. My pronouns are she, her, and hers, and I am broadcasting from Okemos, Michigan near the campus of Michigan State University, where I serve as the director of women’s student services. And I’m also an affiliate faculty member in the MSU student affairs administration master’s program. MSU occupies the ancestral traditional and contemporary lands of the Anishinaabeg – Three Fires Confederacy of Ojibwe, Odawa, and Potawatomi Peoples. The university resides on land seated in the 1819 treaty of Saginaw. So I’m going to open it up now to our panel. Thank you. All of you for being here today for joining me on this exciting one-year anniversary episode. I want to begin by everybody telling a little bit about who you are, what you do, what your current role is on your campus and maybe a little bit about your pathway into, or through student affairs. And so we’re going to start with Stephen. Welcome to Student Affairs NOW.

Stephen Santa-Ramirez:
Yeah. Hi Heather. My name is Stephen Santa-Ramirez. I go by, he him, his pronouns. I currently am an assistant professor of higher ed at the University of Buffalo in Western New York. And I actually got my master’s in the program that Heather is currently a faculty member. So that’s exciting the student affairs administration program MSU go green. I’m currently at the University of Buffalo, which operates on the unseated ancestral territory of the Seneca nation of the Haudenosaunee nations Confederacy. I’m grateful to respectfully work as a guest on these lands with the indigenous peoples who occupied the space before me and those who still call this place home. A little bit about me and my journey through higher ed student affairs, you know, after Michigan State University, I ended up being an assistant director of multicultural affairs and LGBT plus affairs at the University at Texas Arlington. Dallas, Texas area where I did a lot of social racial justice work. While at Michigan state, I worked in residence life and migrant student services. It’s kind of like a dual appointment during my time there. And after pursuing and obtaining my PhD in ed policy, I became a full-time faculty member at the University of Buffalo. So administrative, and then HESA kind of experienced on the faculty side. So excited to be a part of this conversation with all of you awesome individuals.

Heather Shea:
Thank you so much for saying yes to joining us today. Welcome Daisy.

Daisy Rodriguez Pitel:
Thank you so much for having me. I’m also very excited to be a part of this community of listeners. I fell in love with college. My parents are immigrated from the Philippines. They were very strict. And so for me, when I went to college, I felt very liberated because I finally had an opportunity to really learn more about who I am and never left college after I started. So I have worked at different universities throughout the United States. I’ve worked at Weaver State University, Indiana University, New York University, Brute College. And most recently I worked at Pima Community College in Tucson, Arizona for the past 14 years. And I’m really grateful for the opportunities that I’ve had to just learn more about our college student population, undergrad and graduate students. I also have taught Asian American studies and I’m really grateful to be able to contribute to this conversation today.

Heather Shea:
Thank you so much for being here. It’s great. Aja. Welcome.

Aja C. Holmes:
Hi, thank you so much for having me excited to be here. I’m Aja C. Holmes. My pronouns are she, her and cis and I am currently at the University of San Francisco and we are on the unceded lands of the Rama Touche only, and also the Milwaukee only tribes here. And we also acknowledged the painful history and genocide that forced the removal for these territories. And we celebrate the public reserve that indigenous descendants who are working today to preserve and nourish those indigenous identity. So I’m excited to be with you all. I was before this, I was at Sacramento State. So not that far from here. So just like little traffic hour and a half drive just east of here. And so I am been here for three months and I worked with the residential life and the off campus student life. And also the basic needs here.

Heather Shea:
We tracked you down originally, your email address bounced back to me and I’m like, where is she now? And Brian last but not least my colleague at Michigan State.

Brian Hercliff-Proffer:
Hello friends, how are you all? My name is Brian Hercliff-Proffer. I use he him, his pronouns. I’m currently working at Michigan State University has Heather just said and Michigan State University occupies the ancestral traditional and contemporary lands of the three fires, Confederacy of Ojibwe, Odawa, and Potawatomi, and the university itself resides on land seated in the 1819 treaty of Saginaw. Here at Michigan State, I worked with all of our student organizations and the office of student life and a quickly growing fun little community that we have here. My journey is I’m a Michigander through and through. So all of my institutions I’ve been at have spread across the private public sector, small and large, but they’re all here in Michigan. University of Michigan Flint, Concordia, University, Marygrove College, and then here, currently at Michigan State University. So a little bit of everything I like to sample a lot. And so yes, that’s, that’s kinda my journey.

Heather Shea:
So I love this panel because you all represent lots of different, not only geographical locations, but career paths and trajectories. And, I also love that I have a little overlap with each of you in different ways. So thank you so much for agreeing to be on the podcast today as we celebrate our one year anniversary. So as we start off today, I would love to know just a little bit about how you relate to the podcast or how you found out about it. And if you were to recommend one episode for professional development, which would it be and I’m going to start with, with Daisy and then whoever else wants to jump in, just jump in after that.

Daisy Rodriguez Pitel:
I am really grateful to have close relationships with Keith. Keith actually served as my coach for a year and really helped me to be, to think more critically about what is essential to me. I actually read a book about essentialism and then also Glenn is someone that I consider a brother similar, similar to Aja and Heather, we all were a part of the standing committee for multicultural affairs. And then I became more involved with the Asian Pacific American network and served as the chair and, and different roles. And so ACPA has a very special piece in my heart. It’s just really great to have that community. For me, one of the there’s actually two that really stand out, but one that I want to mention is identity conscious supervision in student affairs. I feel like the panel is, or the authors of the book, Shruthi, Craig, and Rob.

Daisy Rodriguez Pitel:
And it was a really important reminder to not lose sense of who we are, especially when we have a supervisor that might not acknowledge all of our identities. You know, and I think about one of the stories that Rob shared about all of the racial strife and injustice that has happened, particularly during this pandemic. And he talked about how he can’t breathe and how he’s often asked to care for students to put programs on for students. And, and he, it really struck me when he said, what about me? Like who’s looking out for me because I can’t for you. And I, it was just such an important reminder that we need to see each other’s humanity and see all of the different parts of our identity.

Heather Shea:
Wow. I just had a chance to relisten to that episode because we re-released, it it’s actually our highest and it came out the first day. Right. it’s the one that has received the most hits and it is that moment where he speaks about that is so incredibly powerful. Yeah. Thank you so much for lifting that one up and I believe Susana just did an amazing job of hosting that one too. Anyone else have thoughts?

Aja C. Holmes:
Yes. So I am now at University of San Francisco, which is a Jesuit campus. And even though I’ve worked at a Jesuit campus before at Georgetown University, before I went back and got my doctorate, I had been away from, you know, a religious campus for awhile and listening to the religious secular spiritual identities on campus really helped me kind of get back into that mindset and frame. What’s it like to be at a campus where you are freely, you know, can express your religions and things of that nature. I want to see also the privilege to be able to do that right. And to be able to talk about that. And I want it to be able to get my mindset back in terms of being in a place where, you know, mass is a part of the welcoming, the convocation part of it and it, and, and to there. And so it was exciting to be able to do that and listen to that. And also to you know, get center myself back and being on a Jesuit campus.

Aja C. Holmes:
To, I also did the the identity conscious one as well. Because my supervision, my supervision development is my dissertation. And so I also, you know, listen to that one, one, because it’s a subject and I want to continue to, you know learn about it and, and, and continue to grow in that area. So that was also a really good episode, too. But since Daisy already talked about it, I wanted to talk about that.

Stephen Santa-Ramirez:
A hard question to choose a episode because they’re all amazing in their own ways. Right. but I, you know, the one that I wanted to lift up in this space since we have to choose one for the point of the conversation which has always also was hosted by Dr. Susana Munoz, and it was titled #undocuSApros voices, right. Laura and Alonzo were highlighted. Some scholar practitioners were highlighted in these conversations. And for me as someone who works alongside a lot of undocumented and DACA college students this was important. I love the fact that there was an episode dedicated specifically to this topic and you know, them sharing their wisdom and knowledge and personally experiences themselves and mixed that as families or as DACA recipients and working alongside these communities you know, something that, you know, that a lot of folks don’t take into consideration administration too, is like some policies are exclusionary to this community.

Stephen Santa-Ramirez:
And some that are a little more inclusive, but specifically for those who are only DACA recipients. Right. And I think Alonzo and Laura and Dr, Susana Munoz really brought to the forefront, the conversation of like, we need to think through different ways to make sure all undocumented students are being supported within resources and support services. And not just those who have a specific designation. Right. So this is one that I thought was super powerful and super important for us to continue to learn from and engage in our own work right. Within our own sphere of influences.

Heather Shea:
Yeah. That episode had a incredible mic drop moment where Alonzo’s talking about applying for doc program on his own campus, and then going back to his office and getting a phone call. And they’re like, we just had a person we’re talking, we’d need to find out about resources. I was like.

Stephen Santa-Ramirez:
That was me. I didn’t tell you that. But that was me. And that’s unfortunate that no one knows how to talk through or support someone that whole identity. Right.

Heather Shea:
Right. Yeah. That was powerful. Brian, what would you share?

Brian Hercliff-Proffer:
You know, agree, there’s so many episodes, either feeling the chills or feeling the feels. I think one that really sticks out is the amplifying APIDA voices. I think it came out at a very intentional time. And probably my affiliation is very personal based, maybe not as professional driven right. For that professional development, but more for it was great to see a APIDA’s on a screen and to be able to just have a conversation about a pitas and the experience. And that was really powerful to me to be able to see not only myself on screen, but also the topic that, that related to myself. Right. And I think it was also learning, I think part of our journeys of learning our identities, as we never know everything. And I learned, I, there was a lot of validation and there was a lot of learning that I did in that podcast as well. And just the people, part of it, like Mindy and all of that, they, I love them already. And it was just really great to see them and hear them as well, especially at that time of the pandemic and everything that was going on and the stuff that they said, I was like, yes. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. So, yeah, that was really, really resonated with me.

Heather Shea:
That was an incredibly powerful episode. I, and Glenn, I know was like, I don’t know how I’m going to get into this conversation. Right. And like the emotional toll that, that all takes. Right. But having that at that moment in time was such a powerful opportunity and also labor on his behalf and all of those folks. So I think it ended up going in a different, right. It was actually planned before you know, we knew it was such a relevant topic, so that’s, that’s one other interesting thing is sometimes our topics come about, like, as a result of something that’s happened, sometimes the entire episode shifts based on something that just happened. And then we go in a slightly different direction. So I want to open up to kind of pressing issues facing your campuses. Cause I mean, you all are on different types of campuses, different locations, or you’re working adjacent to higher ed. I’m curious about how, what are the issues currently facing students? And whoever wants to answer is great, but we’ll start with Aja.

Aja C. Holmes:
Yep. So a couple of things that I’ve noticed in terms of it, and I speak in a general sense, I’ve only been at USF for about three months now, but we know that I live in San Francisco, which is the most expensive, one of the most offensive cities in the nation. Right. And so it’s just the cost of housing. The cost of being able to live, I think is one of the things that are issued us also facing our students. We don’t have enough residence hall space on campus for all 10,000 students to live. So we have to prepare our students who are living in the residence halls, who are going to move off to campus to be able to live in the community and live in a city that is very expensive. We want them to be safe. We want them to live in good and clean environment, but at the same time, you know, our students would pay, you know, what I can put up with living with 80,000 people in one room with a hundred dollars a month because I’m able to make it and I’m able to make ends meet.

Aja C. Holmes:
Right. So that’s, you know, one of the pressing issues that I kind of been hearing about it and within that area, because of the fact that I live in this particular city, and I think the, the other one is also to food insecurities. And so in terms of bundling that together, that basic need, right. And so you have seen these food pantries pop up on college campuses. When I was an undergrad, there wasn’t a food pantry, but I am sure that there were people who were food insecure, who also housing insecure, who might’ve been living in couch surfing as they call it, living on you know, in their cars and not having adequate, you know, access to food, you know? And so the food pantries have been popping up. And so one of the things that’s underneath my, and in my portfolio now is working very closely with the food pantry.

Aja C. Holmes:
And we have, you know, I think the, the heart of people who are really coming out who want to be able to help address this need and work very closely with our students to be able to do that. And it’s been a joy to work with some of the surrounding farms here, and also some with faculty members who’ve been fused, you know, helping out the food pantry as part of their service learning in their in their living, learning communities, in their syllabus. And so that’s been, you know, a really interesting to kind of see that come about and work with that and making sure that our students have access to healthy food and also at the same time produce. So now, in addition to the fact that we have this food pantry, we have a farm and we have we have working with a farm that’s bringing us, you know, fresh produce.

Aja C. Holmes:
So people can have the salads and the vegetables and the rough bridge that is needed for there as well. And now we’re looking to secure more fruits and vegetables. And so those are a couple of things that’s really been from my past couple of weeks, since I’ve only been here a short period of time at USF that has really been at the forefront for me, is, you know securing housing and in a place that you can afford to live. And also at the same time food and trying to get, you know, access to food. So those basic needs that, you know, we need that we all have studied Maslow’s hierarchy of needs, and you know, that those are two basic things you need in order for you to even survive for you to be thinking in class and being able to put, you know, applying theory to practice, you know, in some of those. And so that’s been something that’s been at the forefront for me these past couple of weeks.

Heather Shea:
Yeah. And I know that COVID has certainly amplified all of those issues, right. They existed before, but it’s just added to that other, other topics that are facing students on your campus or things that have been most pressing as we’ve returned, you know, to some level of in-person engagement that you’d like to bring up.

Stephen Santa-Ramirez:
I think I can share a little bit, I think Aja hit it on the, you know, on, on the mark with some of these pressing issues. Some, you know, one thing that I really appreciate about Student Affairs Now is this bringing to the forefront important topics and conversations that may or may not be having on a lot of our campuses, right? Like such as what’s happening with policing, right. And BiPOC bodies and how that, you know, campus police and outside of campus police are affecting traumatizing or you know, this perceived traumatic experience could happen around policing. Right. Which you all did a really good job at bringing in a beautiful panel of folks that talk about this issue in particular with black students. You know, I think not just that my institution I’ve worked at a variety of institutions, and unfortunately it hasn’t changed in regards to like BiPOC bodies still feeling that they are spaces that are not meant for them.

Stephen Santa-Ramirez:
Right. you know, and I wish I can say not, I don’t wish I can say, but it doesn’t just happen in my experiences at predominantly white institutions that I’ve either attended as a student and, or work that I’ve also worked at Hispanic serving institutions and BiPOC students still felt the same way. They’re so, right. So there’s this big, bigger conversation that we need to continue having even an outside of predominantly white schools and historically white institutional spaces about how whiteness and white supremacist ideology is still taking up so much space and power on our college campuses, right. I’m constantly working alongside black and brown students who come to me in confidence of like, this happened to me on my way to school, you know, on my way to class, I got pulled over by a cop and they had no reason to pull me over.

Stephen Santa-Ramirez:
So literally they went back to her car and drove away. They said they were going to look me up in the system and they just struggle way. And to me, that was a moment of realization that is because I wasn’t white. Right. And now I have to come to class and into this space with all of that on my mind and on my spirit. Right. So now I have to think about driving home from class, right? So these are things that folks are constantly worried about and having to navigate on and off of our campuses. Right. And I always talk about this notion of like campus climate, right. Would we also have to like geographical climate, like the state climate, the federal, you know, the sociopolitical climate writ large and how all of that is impacting our students. And sometimes I don’t think we hold enough space for them to participate in healing right. In liberation, which wrapping it back to Student Affairs Now there is an episode hosted by Dr. Raechele Pope with Dr. Anneliese Sing Around this notion of space for BiPOC people to heal and find liberation. So continue moving forward with inequalities. Right. So I’ll stop there, but that’s just some of what I continuously have seen throughout the years. And it doesn’t seem like a simmering down anytime soon, unfortunately. Yeah.

Daisy Rodriguez Pitel:
Heather, I’ll just add cause we have similar issues to, at Pima Community College. But one of the pressing issues in the state of Arizona is not really understanding what are all the COVID-19 regulations and policies. And even at our campus, there’s confusion over, should I wear a mask? Shouldn’t I wear a mask. Sometimes it’s enforced by instructors and sometimes it’s not enforced. And so there is a, I think a lack of confidence and security in knowing that they’re going to be safe on campus. And so that that’s a concern. And when you talk to different folks who work in student services or academic affairs, they give you different answers. So there’s also a lack of consistency in what the messaging is. And that causes additional anxiety in being back on campus. Next week, the governor of Arizona is going to make a decision about what is going to be required and what is not. And he’s leaning towards being very lenient about wearing masks and being vaccinated.

Heather Shea:
My parents still live in Tucson, so we have a constant conversation about kind of what what the differences are, state politics. And I mean, you’re exactly right. Those national and state contexts are, are affecting how our students are engaging in the higher ed. And, and it’s something, it seems outside of our control, but that doesn’t mean that on a daily basis, we’re not having to kind of act or react as a result.

Brian Hercliff-Proffer:
And I think all of that leads, right, the food insecurities and the racial tensions and COVID-19, and all these restrictions, there’s such an anxiety in our students, right. They’re worried. And they’re also having to relearn how to engage in all these conversations and these situations in person, right. Engaging in these situations in conversations, as we’ve learned is very different in the 2d virtual world, right? We’re in the comfort of our home or with family members or with people who normally traditionally we feel safe. And you know, we can turn off the screen a little bit quicker. We can think of it as a separation of that interpersonal connection. Right. But now we have them back on campus in thousands and there’s no way to go, right. They can just poof Harry Potter themselves away. Right. You have to sit in that with them and have to navigate that. And I think that’s, that’s just a really big thing that students, and even us as professionals are having to relearn in engaging in all of this with all of these layers and the topics that we’re bringing up.

Heather Shea:
That is such, that is so absolutely true. And I am a parent to two teenagers and my older kid and I were having this conversation last night because they are just exhausted. And I think the big piece of it is that they had been used to moving from thing to thing, to thing to thing before the pandemic and then their entire way of interacting and engaging in classroom spaces just completely changed. And now it’s like going back feels like relearning how to be a high school student again. Right. so yeah, I think mental health. And so I’m thinking about you know, the conversations that we’re having around our proverbial water cooler. So I know the water cooler metaphor doesn’t necessarily hold up in the zoom age. Right. But, and it’s also a little bit weird that we don’t have those, like before the meeting or after the meeting conversations really in the same kind of ways which has also created some disconnect in our collegial relationships. Brian, I’m curious if you have some things I know of student life. Cause I used occupy that, that suite of offices has a cooler can imagine standing around and talking about things, but what are the things that you’re talking about with your colleagues? And I’d love to hear other folks time in, on this too issues facing students, things you’re talking about with colleagues.

Brian Hercliff-Proffer:
Yeah. interesting enough. I think the watercooler is right outside the office where I am at and you know, your old space is the new water cooler space for us. You know, there’s a little bit more room, but I think, you know, we’re, we’re definitely talking about the mental health, right? We there’s, there’s some concern about how our students are holding everything. You know, our CASS service counseling and psychiatric services are at an all time high usage, right. Also with our employees and staff and faculty usage of those resources. So mental health is something we are touching base almost on a daily basis where what’s going on, resources are being pushed out to our students and full community. And I think our other watercooler is there was an episode and I can’t remember which one because I rewatched half of them in the past couple of days to remember what they were all about.

Brian Hercliff-Proffer:
But there was one where someone was saying that student affairs is a mission critical, like we’ve learned and institutions and learned that student affairs and the work we do is mission critical. And I really appreciated that in the winter when that person said that. And as I was, I like stood up and I was like snapping saying, yes. But I think we’re talking here is what does that mean at Michigan State? And how do we restructure to recognize that collaborative and key piece of the student experience? We’re going through some structural changes. And so that’s really on the forefront is how do we lift up the work that we do not to overshadow anything else, but to integrate it and weave it in so that it is a full on Michigan State experience of your college journey. And we’ve got you from your academics to your extracurriculars, to your food and housing, to your full experience as a human being here at Michigan State. But how do we do that? How does that appear in a institutional structure, especially at Michigan State, we a large institution, right? 50,000 students plus wide reach. So how, what does that look like? And so that’s really on our forefront as well, especially post pandemic when we’re getting, in some ways, some cred in, in the validity of what we do and how role it is and how it affects even student health when they’re interacting with their academics. So we’re, we’re kind of chatting about some of those things.

Heather Shea:
I feel like I know what they do now, now that this all has happened, right. It’s like, I need to call the Dean of students office. Yeah. Aja you were going to jump in, what are you going to add?

Aja C. Holmes:
I one of the things is also to the mental health part. And so I’m glad that Brian kind of brought that up and talked about that. And that was one of the episodes that Raechele was hosting there about mental health and college students. And that was one of the episodes that I actually had my staff listen to because, you know, we needed to know how do we work with students? You know, we do, we know we always have a counseling and psychiatric services on campus. We know we have a CAPS office on campus, you know, but what happens in those after hours? What happens, you know, when those mental health things happen to where we get calls from parents that says, I haven’t talked to my child in X amount of days and you know, I’m flying in because I haven’t seen them or haven’t talked to them in this long.

Aja C. Holmes:
And, you know, and, and at USF, many of our students are from all over the country and all over the world. And so we have to be able to provide some of those mental health services and also be able to get to that in the in-between stages, right. Between going to see CAPS, you know, those nighttime, you know, students don’t have crisis between nine to five. They have crisis 24 hours, seven days a week. And so how do we make sure of that? And so that’s one of the things that we’re definitely working very closely here with our CAPS offices and also to our Dean of students office, to be able to make sure that we’ve had, you know, folks that maybe have some really not great relationships with family. And they’re coming here to you know, sometimes to get away from that and start a new, because colleges is a new, refreshing time for them to transition, to do a lot of different things and we have to be able to provide those spaces.

Aja C. Holmes:
And so some of those things that we’re talking about, you know, amongst our staff members is looking at how do we provide that support for our students, from a mental health perspective, how do we also provide that support for students who are coming and using college as an opportunity to, you know, be the person that they know that they want to be for so long and transition, and part of that might be transitioning. And so how do we have spaces for that? Did our gender inclusive housing, support them to be able to, you know, to do that, you know, and, and on top of this, do they still feel safe to come here and do that with this Catholic Jesuit mission? Right. And one of the things that we pride ourselves on here is that being an open and inclusive place for everybody, you know, even though we know that our, you know, our mission, our values, our, you know, our word into there, we are cure personalities is care for the whole person. And that’s every aspect of that. And that’s one of the things that I think the Jesuits do very well at, and being able to really garner and provide that support and undergrad for that support, for whatever that student’s is going through, no matter what and how, what they’re going through, you know, might conflict with some of the other things that we’re part of what that Catholic Jesuit institution and identity.

Heather Shea:
Yeah. Yeah. Thank you for, thank you for bringing that up as well. And I think, I think it’s really fascinating how our campuses have had to adapt post COVID. Right. And so I’m curious to, to just kind of switch the topic just a little bit, then you all are here today talking as listeners, but if you could be on a topic that’s not about our one-year anniversary, what episode would you like to be on? Or what topic would you like to host a on? And Steph, I’m going to show, I’m going to throw this to you first.

Stephen Santa-Ramirez:
You know, I, again, I can’t just pick one thing, but, you know I would say something that I, in addition to like anything regarding like, like the next students, a sense of belonging, resources and support for BiPOC bodies. I see the importance of mentorship for students at all levels, undergrad, masters, doctoral level and maybe around the conversation where how to build mentors, maybe some good mentoring practices and then maybe bringing in those voices of like students and their actual mentors to kind of have a dialogue together about how their relationship work, you know, and what are both parties or multiple parties getting out of that relationship. And maybe even how can folks reach out to others for mentorship, right? Sometimes it comes, you know, authentically, sometimes it’s through an actual formal program that the institution is offering or a program is offering. But a lot of times, you know, if you not a part of those circles or it got an invitation, or, you know, that’s just not in you intrinsically to go out and take that initiative, like how can other folks be able to comfortably find opportunities for mentoring relationships and how to go about that process? So I love the topic of mentoring and advising. So I think that would be something I would love to see and be a part of.

Heather Shea:
I love that topic. I’m going to, I’m going to volunteer to host that episode or work with you on that. Cause I think that sounds like something. And I think there’s also a little bit of you know, stigma or nuance around it, right? It’s like how do you get a mentor? And we can provide a little bit of that secret decoder ring so that you know, and, and I think it’s, that’s wrapped up in some of the conversations we’ve already been having around whiteness and the replication of the ways that those systems kind of create create challenges for navigation. And so mentoring can be one of those tools that we can use to work against that. So I love it. I love it. Daisy, what about you, if you could be on an episode or host a topic, what would it be?

Daisy Rodriguez Pitel:
Yeah, I, I just want to give props to that too. I think mentoring is so underutilized and so many people want to give back and mentor others. So so for me, if I could be on an episode, I would want to do something on solidarity building across communities. I don’t think that we do that well enough. And it is Latino Heritage month, and I’m actually doing a presentation at Pima called one agenda to communities United. And it’s about the farm workers movement. And living in Tucson Chavez, and Dolores Huerta are spoken about a lot. And rightfully so, but, but we forget about the Filipino American farm workers and Larry Itliong and Philip. So, so this presentation is going to be about these two communities coming together and fighting for farm workers. And I just feel like we need to do that more in student affairs and higher education, we need to be better examples. And, and I think for me, that’s why CMA is such a special place for me because I saw that in action within ACPA. And and I love it whenever I see any members of the CMA families. So, I mean, it’s been a long, long journey. So so that’s what I would do, solidarity building across communities.

Heather Shea:
That’s great. That’s great. I love that episode too. I might have to thumb wrestle my fellow hosts on that one, cause they would be like, we want to hear, talk about that. That’s great. Anyone else have ideas that they’re like, this is what I want to talk about Aja.

Aja C. Holmes:
So, you know, I think the Chronicle put out an article, talked about this great resignation that’s happening and folks who are leaving the field are leaving their jobs, you know, and how the pandemic has really shifted folks thought process in there also have shifted their values and maybe even highlighted areas where they weren’t even utilizing, you know, or, or weren’t doing the best they could for themselves, you know, and self care was highlighted in everywhere. And I, I would love to do, you know a podcast on how lack of supervision or bad supervision or or not great supervision, really, maybe aided in some of that, you know, there one of the things that, you know, we know people leave I guess before this people said they leave bad supervisors, you know, because of the fact that, you know that, that supervision, that leadership is not there or supervisors say, oh, I’m not a micromanager when really you are a micromanager and you don’t know that because you have your own insecurities in terms of that that’s showing up in your work, showing up in how you’re supervising others.

Aja C. Holmes:
And so I really think that that’s something that is, you know, there are many of our student affairs preparation programs, you know and from what I say can still do a better job on teaching folks, how to be, you know, supervisors, you know, not everybody has that assistantship in housing and residence life to be able to practice that. And I, and I think that there are some ways for us to look at how supervision might aid or might, you know, is affecting how folks are leaving positions are leaving jobs because of that. And so I know you all had did a, you know, a session on inclusive supervision, you know, which was great. Would definitely a company in the book that came out too, but you know, some people really need to get off their chest or talk about the horrible supervision that they’ve experienced, you know, because a lot of folks that supervise, who’ve been in supervision positions for awhile, who are leaders, your executive directors, or the VP essays and who are still supervising folks have not gone back to get to training, or has not gone back to continue that training, that a lot of these people have just been supervising, just flying by the seat of their pants.

Aja C. Holmes:
You know, we promote those up until their own ability to where they, you know, can’t be promoted anymore. Right? And so there’s, there’s a point to where, you know, we continue to, to push people up and move them ahead, but not realizing that that supervision part is really lacking. And that’s, what’s causing people to move, leave positions and leave jobs and feel unsupported, you know, a paycheck isn’t enough. A paycheck is not enough for folks to just be able to say, you got a job you’re still getting paid. You should be okay. We have got to look at how morale and how that supervision or horrible supervision leads and how that that morale is drawn from that student are gone from a professional staff member and they’re leaving the field and people have realized this because we were all panicking during this pandemic and didn’t know that.

Aja C. Holmes:
And when we said, oh, we’re shutting down. What does that mean? Housing & Residence Life was rocked to the core during this pandemic. We have been on top of, for so long. We’ve always had the money because we always got people living in the residence halls, but we know that we were shocked to the grew up to the core with this pandemic when they said we are shutting this down and everything’s moving online. There’s no reason for folks to live in our residence halls. If I can take my classes from a zoom for my own bedroom. Right? So that was something that really rocked it. And there were some decisions that were made in the best interest of the university, never invested in just of the staff member when you laying off people left and right. But, you know, because of that and, and not making the decision to, you know, how can we repurpose these folks?

Aja C. Holmes:
How can the fact that we know we have a hiring freeze, but some of these residents life folks who are really generalists, you know, Jack of all trades, yes, we are. We can move them from other areas and repurpose them other areas, but this great resignation has let us know that some of our leadership and some of our folks who are leading in these areas need to go back and figure out how you can be a best supervisor for others who are in there. They, how to be that supervision, leadership and management are not interchangeable. You do those things separately. And so there’s probably like maybe 15 different topics. How did that, I just gave you, but I just read this article and discussed it with my leadership team and, you know, and I work in housing and residence life. And so we are sometimes at the core of some of that, but there’s some things there that we have that folks don’t want to, you know, admit that you’ve been in the field for 30 years, but yet your supervision is horrible and we need to call those people out.

Daisy Rodriguez Pitel:
It’s demoralizing. I mean, it is demoralizing.

Heather Shea:
Yeah. You’re getting snaps from Stephen to 18 ideas.

Stephen Santa-Ramirez:
Yeah, I have to say, so I have the pleasure of getting to teach.

Heather Shea:
If you remember the pro-devo seminar which allows me to have time with the students, all four semesters of the ma of the master’s program. And we’re where we picked up the book creating sustainable careers in student affairs after I watched that episode. And of course, Kris Wren his, writes the forward. So you know, after you, after you read her forward, you’re like, oh my gosh, I have to do something with this book in class. But I, I really think that we’re, we’re on the precipice of either a complete professional revision. I mean, this field in order for us to want to continue to stay, has to start treating us better.

Heather Shea:
Right. But also I think the systems around this field on our campuses have to start acknowledging, and I liked how you know, Brian mentioned earlier the whole mission critical piece, because I do think it’s brought to the forefront how valuable student affairs is. So, all right. So I’m gonna move to a lightning round. I was I thought this would be a fun thing to kind of do to get a whole bunch of other kind of topics out into the idea universe. And part of what I think about the lightning round is like just really quickly responding, right? So we’re going to do two warm up questions, which are not related to episodes are not related to the, to the podcast. And then we’re going to move well kind of, I guess, a sort of somewhat our but anyway, then we’re going to move to like specifically naming episode. So we’ve got a prescribed order, lightening round, one word or two word answers or the topic itself. And so first question is, do you watch Student Affairs Now on YouTube or do you listen on iTunes? Stephen.

Stephen Santa-Ramirez:
YouTube.

Daisy Rodriguez Pitel:
YouTube

Aja C. Holmes:
Podcast.

Heather Shea:
Brian

Stephen Santa-Ramirez:
Youtube.

Heather Shea:
Okay. The next time, I’m not going to say your name. You’re just going to follow in that same order. Okay. Alright. I got, we got it this time. Okay. and I asked this question only because like I said, iTunes, right. So you’re not going to listen on iTunes if you have an Android. So we’ll, we’ll go through who has iPhone and Android. So iPhone or Android, Stephen.

Stephen Santa-Ramirez:
iPhone.

Daisy Rodriguez Pitel:
iPhone.

Aja C. Holmes:
iPhone.

Brian Hercliff-Proffer:
iPhone.

Heather Shea:
iPhone. All right. So my partner out there, who’s listening to this probably on his Google Pixel can roll his eyes right now. Okay. So now we’re going to get into the emotional and the practical, right. So like, what are the episodes that have had an emotional connection for you or had some practical implications? So what is the episode during which you laughed or your favorite fun episode? Stephen?

Stephen Santa-Ramirez:
I don’t have a favorite fun episode, but I will say that one of my favorite episodes is the Why they Hate Us by Dr. Susana Munoz And Dr. Lindsay Pérez Huber.

Daisy Rodriguez Pitel:
Okay. I’m going to say the Side Hustle Phenomenon.

Aja C. Holmes:
Okay. I was going to say that one too, as well, because as someone who’s trying to find a side hustle.

Brian Hercliff-Proffer:
I love Geeking Out one, one of the first episodes that came out, but it was. Just nice to be like, hey, fellow people.

Heather Shea:
I love it. That was great. That was great. Okay. What episode made you think, Stephen?

Stephen Santa-Ramirez:
I think all of them do, but racial healing and liberation on campus which was highlighting Dr. Anneliese Singh made me really think about healing and liberation to continue doing some good racial or social justice work.

Daisy Rodriguez Pitel:
I’m going to say workplace culture, humanity and innovation. One of the speakers talked about the giving tree and to think really critically about that book.

Heather Shea:
Oh, Chris Conzon. That was such a powerful quote. Yeah. Aja.

Aja C. Holmes:
Let’s say the foster care, the foster care one. And I think that’s a such a forgotten population that we forget, you know, we think that everybody okay. Once your 18 year we’ll be okay. But these folks, you know, really when you’ve been in foster care for so long, especially if you are black and brown and you’ve been in there for so long and, and to age out of foster care system on a college campus, there’s more resources. And then college campus needs to step up to provide those resources. So I appreciated learn a little bit more about, about that.

Heather Shea:
Yeah.

Brian Hercliff-Proffer:
The post COVID conversation really got me thinking of everything. There’s some validation, there was some questions, there was some yes. Some stuff to do now that I I’ve been thinking about ever since I listened to it.

Heather Shea:
Cool episode that you learned something you didn’t already know.

Stephen Santa-Ramirez:
Into supporting college students in recovery episode. I didn’t know that less than 5% of institution actually have programs catered to students in recovery. Right. Which is an issue that I don’t think we talk about much. So that’s something that I, as a statistic that I was able to learn and kind of reflect on and see how I can work towards helping in that initiative and within my sphere of influence.

Heather Shea:
Thank you.

Daisy Rodriguez Pitel:
Something that I found really interesting as I actually watched the looking looking back, looking forward and I really enjoyed hearing from the four different hosts. And for me, something that I learned is the curious question. And I think that’s a really good way to begin thinking about maybe a program or a need or how, you know, what needs to be addressed on your campus. So I really liked the curious question.

Aja C. Holmes:
I would say that the veterans, and so as we know that within our political center, we have evacuated certain areas of the world where we’ve been in forever. And so now we have veterans who are now returning back to our campuses or returning to our campuses to continue their study, to pick up where they left off, you know? And so how do we support those folks in, and in addition to how do we latch on to the mental health part of that? You know, when you have the veteran and you have the one who had this PTSD and how do we utilize that? And so that was a really good episode to be able to learn a little bit more about veterans affairs, how veterans offices were popping up on college campuses. And now that we have many folks who are coming back from that, how do we support those folks?

Brian Hercliff-Proffer:
I mean, I could cheat and just say all of them, because I learned from every episode, but one that’s a little bit more tangible would be the assessing student learning you know, little dabbling, little assessment, but nothing like that, intentional mapping and envisioning what it can be, especially in the realm of student organizations or student development or at an all of that world. That I learned a lot, the notes I have are plentiful.

Heather Shea:
Well, okay. Episode, I don’t know who wrote these lightening round questions. Probably me, the last one. That’s not like a quick answer, but this one episode with the most applicable takeaways to your current role in student affairs or adjacent work Stephen.

Stephen Santa-Ramirez:
Again, all of them, but I would say because a lot of my scholarship centers, the experience and policy effects of undocumented folk the undocuSApros voices episode really helps me think through different ways to see my scholarship, to kind of promote this work with others of how to build inclusive communities and policies and resources for these communities. And it also allows it, I use part of that episode and one of my classes, cause I teach a class on race racism and undocumented collegians and higher ed. So it’s really been applicable for me in my own work and hopefully for my students as well.

Daisy Rodriguez Pitel:
You know, I want to say like all of the sessions that I watched, one similar thread that stood out is just humanity. And just reminding ourselves to honor folks as humanity. And one session that that comes to mind is in workplace culture, humanity and innovation. David shared a story about how one of his staff members asked to take time off because of family death. And she apologized, she said, I’m sorry that I can’t be at work. I have to go to this funeral. And David said, don’t apologize, take care of what you need to, and, and it’s sad to me that that individual has worked in higher ed. And this is the first time she has a supervisor who’s saying it’s okay, go take care of yourself, go be with family. That’s important. And so, so for me, that’s a reminders. How do I treat people? How do I want to be treated? And do we hold people accountable when they aren’t behaving, right. Not treating us and recognizing our humanity.

Aja C. Holmes:
I’m going to say, well, there’s, there’s maybe three. So the transition is one that

Heather Shea:
Lightening round Aja. HAHA

Aja C. Holmes:
Cause as I just transitioned from one institution to the other one, and then the other one I’ll keep it at two was the hearing from the conversation with the ACPA and NASPA leaders. And so that was, you know, as someone who’s on the governing board for ACPA, it was really good to hear from that leadership in terms of how those organizations, you know, create and also support what we’re doing here in the field. Yeah.

Heather Shea:
Yes, yes, yes.

Brian Hercliff-Proffer:
I haven’t thought about the ACPA president one, but dang. Okay. That was a good one too. Yes. I think that that workplace culture, humanity innovation one was just one that I took a lot with. I have a new supervisor, so I am trying to soak up all the information on how to unlearn and not do what I struggled with with previous supervisors. Right. and so that one just had a lot of nuggets to help even frame what this means to build a team, to build a culture of care with individuals you supervise, or even colleagues you supervise with together or something. It’s a new realm. So it was really helpful for me to get it, just get some wisdom and some, some framing as I enter into this world. So.

Heather Shea:
I love it. That’s great. So this was a suggested question at the very end. So thank you Daisy for suggesting this. And, and I think what the companion episode to today’s episode is us as hosts kind of talking a little bit about where we’ve been, where we’re going and then how we benefited. So I know for us, like this is truly a labor of love. You know, the connection that we form with our panelists as well as with our listeners has just been a phenomenal joy to be added to our lives right. In a year where like we needed that. So I would love to hear like in, in a word or a few words, Aja how have you benefited from the, from the podcast.

Stephen Santa-Ramirez:
We’re talkers. I would say that I’ve benefited, it’s so insightful, right? So many different topics. That’s so insightful. But also it’s a lot, it’s a lot, it has allowed me to get free professional development you know, being this lifelong learner that I am. So thank you for the great work that you and the rest of your team does for this other.

Heather Shea:
Thank you. Thank you.

Daisy Rodriguez Pitel:
Yeah. So I’m going say I really appreciate how relevant all of the topics have been and how timely. So for me, it’s really been an opportunity to connect with folks through zoom, even though, you know, I’m watching it, but that I love that like it has been free professional development and the community has just been what I needed. So thank you all for doing this.

Aja C. Holmes:
So I was to say also to utilizing it in my staff meetings, be able to have them listen to it and then bring it back and say, Hey, what do we think about this? What are some things we’re learning? You know, and, and having some discussion of questions around some of the episodes that we’ve had and utilizing some of these episodes to also supplement training during times, you know, for our training to do that. So we’re going to have, you know, meet with CAPS and then utilize the mental health in our college students episode to kind of also bring a little bit of that theory to practice putting that into play in terms of, you know what’s happening with our students. And so that’s how I’ve used Student Affairs Now.

Brian Hercliff-Proffer:
You know, the number of times I’ve been with a graduate assistant or a practicum student, and they’ll say something like, Ooh, wait, there’s a podcast. I just listened to it. Let me go figure out what it was. That’s been a huge thing. I think it’s also been very validating and relatable. I think seeing peers, you know, talking about the same issues I’m struggling with for validating the work that we do as a field, that we are a field that we have value in higher ed as individuals listening to a lot of the identity conversations that have been happening on the podcast I been having it visible and spoken of and about is something that has been needed for a very long time. And so I’ve really appreciated that you haven’t been afraid to, to go there and to kind of start reaching those conversations that we really need to have in the field as professionals and as human beings with each other. So I, I just value that just so much.

Heather Shea:
Yeah. I feel it’s always a little bit self promoting when I’m like sitting in a class or a staffing in my student affairs now, like there’s something relevant there, but I do really feel like this field is evolving. Right. So part of the now concept is like, okay, what’s next? What’s next? So we’re going to wrap up final thoughts. I can’t tell you how much I’ve enjoyed this conversation today. It was, it’s been a really challenging week and this is totally what I needed. So final thoughts, anything else that you’d like to share at the end, Brian, I’m going to, we’re going to do opposite order this time. So Brian.

Brian Hercliff-Proffer:
So much is going through my head right now. I think being able to have the resources like this is hugely beneficial accessible in something quick and easy that I have to use for myself, but also because we work with so many students, graduate assistants, students and fellow professionals and just the topics just have me thinking every single day. So I’m just in a cloud of thoughts all the time, thinking of what could be, what is where, how to get there. So yes, just kind of thoughts, random, but they’re there.

Aja C. Holmes:
And I think utilizing the podcast know with my staff and introducing them to this particular you know, platform it’s also accessible, like you said, you can watch it on YouTube or you can also listen to it, you know, on iTunes. So I appreciate that. And I also appreciated how you had other podcasts or things that were also student affairs related to as well, right? Like what else.

Heather Shea:
Yes, the podcast jamboree.

Aja C. Holmes:
The Scholar Tea and the meeting after the meeting and stuff like that and had those books on, let’s talk about that because there’s room for everyone to be able to have something like this, to be able to talk about this, and I’m happy that the pandemic is something, or even for that, you know, student affairs, like we can do this. It doesn’t have to be about some other topic. Student affairs can get into the podcast industry. So I appreciate that

Heather Shea:
At podcast, Jan was EV it was amazing. It just came out. The episode just came out. So if you haven’t listened to it yet, you should totally do it. But I love that Keith brought together 12 different podcasts to share, and there’s going to be a part two because there were some people who couldn’t make it. So, yeah. Awesome. Sorry. I’m interrupting final thoughts. Daisy.

Daisy Rodriguez Pitel:
I want to say that it has been really refreshing to be a part of a student affairs community that welcomes community college professionals, because even if community college wasn’t a part of the title, every session was relevant. And I was able to connect it to the work that I do because working in a community college setting, we don’t have the same student affairs culture and community that exists in universities. And so thank you for being inclusive. I’m not surprised that y’all were inclusive and didn’t have to mention community colleges and we were so welcome. So, so thank you, Heather, please like share that with your crew, because that’s really important because I have felt invisible sometimes attending higher ed professional development places and community college folks are just invisible and left out.

Heather Shea:
Yes, yes, indeed. And that is, that is definitely a part of the larger conversation. So when we think about panelists, we’re always kind of thinking about like, how do we, how do we think about not just like our social identities, but also our professional identities and roles and types of campuses too. Thanks for naming that. Stephen you’re, you’re closing us out on final.

Stephen Santa-Ramirez:
Well, let’s hope it’s gone on a good note. I echo all of my peers and colleagues on this call, sentiments regarding student affairs. Now it has been a true blessing to have this in my tool belt to learn from myself as a lifelong learner, but also to promote it to various colleagues and my students that I get the privilege to work and learn along side. I think what I would love to see moving forward is elevate more of the student voices in this space, right? I think a lot of the topics, a lot of the topics are about students, right. And it’s great that we get to work alongside students, but we can’t always talk on behalf of students. And I would love to see some panelists and maybe some student hosts on some of the really, really important topics just to elevate their voices and their experiences as well.

Heather Shea:
Yes, yes. 100% agree. And so if you have suggestions of students who we should include, I think you’re going to be seeing more of that because we definitely.

Stephen Santa-Ramirez:
See that.

Aja C. Holmes:
I would say we can start with the residence hall associations, you know, that might be one way to do that in our in our hall associations. And so that might be a good way for us to kind of start with the students and looking at that, and then rolling into maybe the student government and stuff. For sure.

Heather Shea:
Yeah. Yeah. If you if you listened to the policing episode jail and student by, oh my goodness. Like brilliant, phenomenal. I learned so much from her and I learned, you know, I think that ultimately at the end of the day, my final word is that like, this is about students, right? This is about serving students. This is about us getting what we need professionally, so we can do our work and wholeness and in truth with our students. So I absolutely agree in it. I think that’s one thing that we will continue to talk about as hosts. I love the final thoughts. And so thank you all so much for contributing to today’s episode for your time and your energy and for investing in us. For those of you who are watching, who do listen and use this and professional development, or perhaps you’re a faculty member, if you send us an email at host@studentaffairsnow.com, we will send you stickers.

Heather Shea:
So we have some like fancy swag for our one-year anniversary that we’d be happy to pass along and share and mug. Yup. We’ve got some, some student affairs now mugs. Yay. So thank you all again, heartfelt appreciation to our colleague and friend Nat Ambrosey who does all of our behind the scenes production, she’ll cut and paste and do all these fancy things for us. So thank you Nat. If you are listening today and you’re not already receiving our weekly newsletter, you can visit our website and scroll to the bottom or you like, I think there’s a pop-up now. And you can add your email to our MailChimp list. Our archives are growing. I think we’re over 60 episodes now. And if you did find this conversation useful, please share it. On social that really helps us keep this conversation going and building our learning community.

Heather Shea:
Final shout out to our sponsors today. We are so appreciative of your support. So a little bit about them. This episode was sponsored by Anthology, transform your student experience and advanced co-curricular learning with Anthology engage. With this technology platform. You are able to easily manage student organizations, efficiently plan events, and truly understand student involvement to continuously improve your engagement efforts at your institution. Learn more by visiting anthology.com/engage. And I’ll say to Brian knows this platform very, very well. That’s his world. Stylus is proud also to be a sponsor of the student. First out podcast, browse their student affairs, diversity and professional development titles@styluspub.com. Use the promo code essay. Now for 30% off all books plus free shipping, which is amazing. You can also find Stylus on Facebook, YouTube, Instagram, LinkedIn, Twitter @styluspub. So please take the time to visit our sponsors. Learn more about their amazing offerings again, I’m Heather Shay, thank you to all of our listeners. In addition to the five of you who have contributed so much to the podcast over the past year everybody who’s listening and watching today, please be well, drink your water and take care of yourselves. Thanks everyone.

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