Susana Muñoz
I’ve gotten off this gerbil wheel and destroyed it and thinking about how I think about the different ways how to approach work, and being sustainable. Right. And so, I think I’ve also been impacted by women of color passing away and the job and thinking a lot about what I, what I want most from my life, you know, in, in this position, and I think I want to be more balanced, but also, like, understand that, you know, these institutions aren’t going to love you back, you know. And so, yes, you can pour love into the institution, into your students into your work, but to be conscious of the fact that you can’t pour all yourself all your spirit, you know, into it, because I think that becomes very unhealthy.

Keith Edwards
Hello, and welcome to Student Affairs now, I’m your host Keith Edwards. Today we have a special opportunity to talk to one of our hosts Susana Muñoz about her sabbatical experience. This experience was transformative and it has opened Susanna up to new ways of engaging and being in the world and with higher education. And I’m really excited to talk about your experience and where it is taking you in this conversation today. Student Affairs NOW is the premier podcast and online learning community for 1000s of us who work in alongside or adjacent to the field of higher education and student affairs. We release new episodes every week on Wednesdays find details about this episode, or browse our archives at studentaffairsnow.com. And today’s episode is sponsored by Symplicity. A true partner Symplicity supports all aspects of student life with technology platforms that empower institutions to make data driven decisions. As I mentioned, I’m your host, Keith Edwards, my pronouns are he him, his I’m a speaker, consultant, and coach, and you can find out more about me at Keithedwards.com. I’m recording this from Minneapolis, Minnesota, at the intersections of the ancestral homelands of both the Dakota and the Ojibwe peoples. Let’s get to Susana, so glad to be with you here today and have this conversation. I know folks and listen to your episodes and your conversations. But why don’t you take the liberty to tell folks even a little bit more about you.

Susana Muñoz
Thanks so much. Happy to be here with you today. Again, my name is Susana Muñoz, my pronouns are she hers and ella. And I’m associate professor at Colorado State University in the higher education leadership program at in Colorado State is the ancestral homelands of the US Cheyenne and Arapaho people. Um, yeah. So that’s a little bit about me what I’ve been up to. And do you want to talk about the sabbatical stuff is that we

Keith Edwards
want you to talk about the sabbatical stuff. So you’ve taken a sabbatical away from the podcast for the past year, and away from your role at Colorado State. So what have you been doing? How did that come to be? What has shifted?

Susana Muñoz
Yeah, so I want to just name that taking a sabbatical is definitely a privilege. And I have been teaching full time as a faculty member since 2011. And so and I’ve been in the program coordinator role while I was in the program coordinator role for five years. So. So it was time, you know, it was definitely a way for me to sort of like, okay, I need to, I need to take a break. But also, you know, when the academy is going to be the academy, so you have to apply for your sabbatical and kind of note all the things that you want to do, how productive you want to be all of the things. So it’s an application process that you put forth to like your dean and Provost and so, so I wanted to do some work at the University of Arizona in Tucson. Who doesn’t want to take sabbatical in the desert, right. And so I had the opportunity to work with their Hispanic Serving initiatives and their HSI person, Dr. Marla Franco. So I worked with her on some of the in participated in some of the HSI initiatives that they have the University of Arizona, Colorado State Universities and emerging HSI and so I feel like I needed to learn all of I can learn to help sort of guide and, and lead and provide wisdom and research around, you know, what does it mean to be an HSI when you’re a predominantly white institution? So so that was part of my, my research my my sabbatical, but I also, you know, did get a Spencer grant when I was on sabbatical to do some research around Transfer Pathways for DACA and undocumented students from one HSI at a community college to another HSI at a four year institution. So what is what is serving this look like? Particularly when these bodies are counted and how are they being served and also thinking about how the social political context of Arizona impacts serving this for undocumented and DACA students, and so I was in Arizona during the election cycle and that that was wild. That was something that I have never seen, like in Colorado, like in terms of like the timezone of verbiage and language that was used to categorize immigrants and so blatantly in billboards. So, so that was definitely, you know, that exposure that was like, Yeah, this is this, this is a different social political context that, that I’m was getting used to so, so ultimately, that’s, you know, kind of what I, I did sort of for, like, work wise, but to be honest with you, I, I rested. And, you know, in the beginning, it was really hard to rest and be still and not be productive, and dealing with shame and guilt around resting. So, so yeah, there was a lot of, I would say, tears, and around that, which, to some may sound silly, you know, to, to have these emotions around the notion of rest. But I think it’s really rooted in how I was maybe socialized, you know, in graduate school, and in my faculty role around productivity, or your worth being rooted in the productivity. And so there was a lot of emotional unpacking that I had to do around the notion of work, and how it felt uncomfortable in my body, that my body was rejecting rest, in a way that pissed me off and in a way that I was feeling a lot of, like, my emotions about it. So. So I think that was one of the biggest realizations of like, the importance of like, retraining my body to normalize a pause, and how to re shift in my thinking that my entire worth, identity is not wrapped up in work. Right. And so it was hard, I have to say, it was it was hard to get to a point where, you know, I, I was even having conversations with people around like, I, what do I fear that people will forget about me or something, or I fear that I, that I’m not doing enough for my community, or the people that I work with them for. So I had to kind of, you know, be marinate, be in it. process. I hope that you know, and so, so yeah, I think I’m going to talk about sabbatical as this like, Yes, I, it was, oh, so rooted in some of this work. But I think for me, it was an awakening moment for me around my worth, and what I value in how I got to a place where my worth was an identity was wrapped up in my productivity. And I produced and how do I, how do I kind of backtrack that a little bit more?

Keith Edwards
Yeah. So it took sabbatical, the sabbatical experience to sort of make this really obvious to you probably something you noticed along the way, but maybe didn’t pay much attention to to make this really obvious to you. And then once it was obvious kind of wanting to unbraid my identity, my work, my productivity, my worth, these are separate things.

Susana Muñoz
Yes. Yeah, exactly. And I think it was, you know, the whole purpose of like, the whole word sabbatical is was repressed. Right? And so I think it, it was, it was definitely the wake up call around, like getting that biofeedback from my body around stillness, right around, it’s okay to, you know, read for fun and not feel like guilty and shame around having having that, you know that privilege or that, you know that time for yourself and so you’re right I you know, there were and I think I, I preached this right I preach self care I preach, you know, we need to be kind to our bodies and our spirits. I preach it to my students. But it wasn’t until you know, and I do practice like self care here and there. But it wasn’t until I was forced to just pause, and maybe in tune or with myself there really got messages from my body that I’m uncomfortable with this part. And so I think that was that was one of the the transformational moments of sabbatical was, okay, I got this message. What do I do with it? What, like, what do I do with this new information? And, you know, how do I dismantle the gerbil wheel that I’ve been on? And think of other ways other healthier ways to view work? Right.

Keith Edwards
I’m interested? Before we’re talking about that part about where it takes you. I’m interested in the difference between your planned sabbatical and your actual sabbatical? Because you’re talking about applying right, which you do long before this, the battle begins and you’re imagining your thinking, and you’re still in that state of productivity, you’re still on the gerbil wheel is still doing all of that. And sort of what you plan and what you proposed and what you imagined. And then, I guess the way I’m imagining it is a very different experience unfolded. And maybe at the beginning, tell me how I’m wrong about this. At the beginning, it was probably pretty similar to what you planned. And the further you got it got further and further and further away from what you had anticipated. Imagine. Strategy. Yeah.

Susana Muñoz
I mean, it’s, it was still the plan, but it was being away from my institution. It was being away from work life and being just a visitor. Right, that felt different. There was there was nobody checking me. Right? There was there was really, there was nobody, you know, checking on my productivity.

Keith Edwards
Oh, and you did a great job of that. I mean, as a podcast, we were sending emails, and you’re like, Yeah, I’m not reading your text messages. I’m not reading those either. So you really did build some things around to take and give yourself that space.

Susana Muñoz
And in setting up those boundaries, because I carpal mentalized things that were happening at CSU, there are things happening, right? For sure. And so I did a good job of like, Nope, you know, that’s going to be when I come back, but for now, that’s going to not necessarily consume my energy. You know, so, you know, for me, it was more about like this, you know, this progression of like, you know, thinking about, you know, rest and also I have to name the fact that I was staying at my BFFs house, Judy Marquez, Qiyamah. And, you know, and she, she was, you know, works to the faculty member at U of A and and so I was really, in our house, swimming in our pool, making friends with her dog. And also, I would come home and feel like, Oh, here’s, here’s what I did, and, and her kind of saying, I think you’re doing too much. Right? I don’t think this is what the purpose is for you to you know, be on sabbatical. And so the more that I tapered off, sort of like, you know, my to do list and thinking about ways to like okay, you know, being active reading for fun, and I got into a lot of these young adult books, which were amazing, right? And so I started reading those and I’m getting consumed with other books other than the academic books. And so and it started, like, the more that I drifted away from like the work, it’s the more that those feelings of, you know, guilt and shame started to kind of creep in. And so, so I think for me, it was sort of like, as you said, just this progression and, and sort of like this. Why am I feeling guilty? Why is there shame for me around? Not being Uber productive? Right. And I think, also think it stems from being an immigrant. I think it stems from a work ethic that I grew up with. And so I had to, like, unpack all this, all this,

Keith Edwards
all I had a year and not a semester,

Susana Muñoz
I am so glad I had a year because I even when I got to the semester, I was like, Oh, I am not ready. I’m not ready. And

Keith Edwards
so middle of this metamorphosis

Susana Muñoz
I was and the way just so folks know, the way the year works, is that you, the institution only pays half your salary. And so I was fortunate enough to have savings and do some consulting work. And but, you know, it was a blessing to take that whole year because, you know, sabbatical only comes around, like, every so often, and I talked to my colleagues that are near retirement, and they talk about how they’ve never taken a sabbatical. And I’m, you know, I’m just sort of like dumbfounded around, like, what this is, you know, like, regardless of you know, that our situations, I think anyone that works in higher education, regardless of your faculty, or staff, I think deserves a sabbatical of some sorts, and what that can look like to just get rejuvenated to just get rest, but also, you know, have the time to just honor yourself honor, honor, the ways that you know, in which you show up, and think about what what kind of things you want differently for yourself.

Keith Edwards
And to reset your relationship, reset your relationship with yourself, reset your relationship with scholarship, reset your relationship with work, reset your relationship with productivity, and when you’re in it, it can be hard to notice that to see that to recognize it and do that reset. So how has it shifted your relationship with your work in higher education, or even just a relationship with higher education?

Susana Muñoz
So the comeback was strange, right? Cuz it’s like, holy cow, how did we do like a whole day retreat and meetings in the past, like, my body was not ready for the, you know, the meetings and the schedules and things like that. And so, so I’ve had to really be, you know, intentional, you know, I talk about the fact that I, I’ve gotten off this gerbil wheel and destroyed it and thinking about how I think about the different ways how to approach work, and being sustainable. Right. And so, I think I’ve also been impacted by women of color passing away and the job and thinking a lot about what I, what I want most from my life, you know, in, in this position, and I think I want to be more balanced, but also, like, understand that, you know, these institutions aren’t going to love you back, you know. And so, yes, you can pour love into the institution, into your students into your work, but to be conscious of the fact that you can’t pour all yourself all your spirit, you know, into it, because I think that becomes very unhealthy. And so, it’s just kind of thinking about just the boundaries, you know, and, and there’s some days where it’s, I’m tired, you know, from, you know, the days that I have a little bit packed, and I listen to my body more. And, and so I’m, I’m paying attention to the messages that I’m receiving from my body more so than I have in the past. And so that means, you know, I, I shift, you know, the productivity you know one of the things that I’ll share with our listeners is that you know, going up for full professor, you know, something that is down the road for me and, and something that I want to apply for. But, you know, some of the, you know, the recommendations were like, I think maybe you’ll be like a slam dunk, if you like published six more things, right? And I’m just like, what I’m, you know, I’m not going to put my body through that, you know, I’m, I’m not even going to entertain this fact that I have to reach a certain number. Right. And so, um, so I’ve kind of, you know, come to terms with, like, if it happens, it happens, you know, if it if it doesn’t, like, I am, I’m okay with it. You know. And so, I think it took sabbatical from me to realize, like, I don’t have to continue to climb, right, and, and reach these milestones in ways that I think the academy presents in, you know, in an unhealthy way, and going up for Fall is so wonky for me, to be honest, I think that’s way more ambiguous than going up for tenure. And so. So I think that we have these notions that like, yeah, if somebody really taps you and like, yeah, you’re ready. And then, but ultimately, like, it’s, you know, it’s all these other things that I think are not very, I don’t know, I don’t want to say unhealthy. But I want to also say like, I think you have to make a choice of you know, what you want, and how you achieve what you want doesn’t have to necessarily be at the expense of your health.

Keith Edwards
You have ever the people you work with noticed something different. Your fellow staff members, your students, the I think hearing some feedback,

Susana Muñoz
I think the feedback that I’m getting, is that I’m more grounded, more present. Yeah. Yeah. Is when I’m, you know, in class, and it was funny, it took me a while to like, go back to teaching. Right? Like, where is everything? Where, what breakout rooms? What, how do we do this? You know, so it, it was an adjustment to go back to the teaching, and I love the teaching part. And I think I, you know, I taught this summer, and it felt like, it felt like a different, like, I was a different professor. I felt like I was, you know, honoring myself and try to model for students how to, how do I honor myself in this process? You know, how do I get more grounded? How do I help other students get more grounded with a space and, you know, the, they’re who they are? And their wellness. So it’s, I think it’s definitely made me more in intentional and mindful Professor than I have been in the past. And so even students, I can’t use sound rested, who’s like, I don’t know how I sound and not rested. But yes, I, I’ll take that. But But I think also, I’m, I’m realizing like, I’m going to be intentional, where I put my energy in. Right. And so things that I can’t control should not be in my mind. And so I’m trying to also like control the things that are consuming my my head and energy. Yeah.

Keith Edwards
I love that. It’s just another thing you’re teaching, right? Whatever the class is about, but also being present yourself. You know, I think so many of us, one of the ways we get socialized is by watching what people we admire, teachers and leaders. There’s, there’s what they say and then there’s what they do, and we learn from both of us. And it sounds like you’re really modeling for your students. Some things that are serving you. But it’s not just you’re not just doing that for yourself. You’re doing that for them as well.

Susana Muñoz
Yeah. No, I hope so. I think that’s my purpose.

Keith Edwards
I mean, I don’t want to oversell it but metamorphosis transformation, awakening, spiritual shifts, seems like what we’re talking about here, how has it just shifted not just your work and how Education, how has it shifted just your, your way of being in the world?

Susana Muñoz
I think it just feels like I am more attuned to what my purpose is, and how I want to spend my time on this earth, right. And I think, you know, you know, it was hard on my family to be honest, you know, to be away and, you know, I would be away, you know, we set a time and come back for a week or so and then go back. And so that shifted sort of, like, my, my family a little bit, but and so now just sort of, like, I’m, I am just happy to be home, like, I can just feel like comfortable in my own space and not needing to be in 12 different places, you know, and around, you know, I’m in this in the United States, but I also feel like I am taking care of better taking better care of myself. And so I developed a routine. And then got into yin yoga, I don’t know if like, you know, what yin yoga is, but it’s essentially yoga poses that you hold for, like three to five minutes. And that’s really challenged me to just be still. Yeah, and just, you know, you’re supposed to kind of like hold a position kind of, to the level of a little bit on the edge of uncomfortableness, but also like making sure that you’re not pushing your body down that, well, much to like, feel pain. And so that practice has really helped me. Just practice being still and getting comfortable with, you know, the that edge, right that Jove uncomfortable ability.

Keith Edwards
what a great antidote to the productivity message, whereas I am going to be perfectly still for three to five minutes, and focus on where I’m touching the ground and focus on my body and focus on my breathing. It just seems like, I had never heard of this before. But it seems like a really great antidote to some of the things that you’re wanting to push back on and get away from and, and practice, right, a constant reminder and a constant practice.

Susana Muñoz
Yes, so I’m doing that. And I find myself sleeping better. Being more, I mean, just kind of not having like a fog in my head, but just having more clarity and focus as well. So it’s helped out it’s been beneficial. And so I think those, like, the, the notion of pouring into yourself first and mean, I don’t know, like, we’ve always known that, you know, I’ve always known like, you have to take care of yourself before you take care of others. But I’ve never really thought about what, which of those what things I wanted to pour on myself, that was super intentional, in ways that helps me develop and grow as a human being. And so I think those are the things that has been really beneficial for me in terms of how I show up as a person, my purpose, and how my liberation doesn’t have to be, you know, all about the work. Right?

Keith Edwards
You want to say more about your liberation?

Susana Muñoz
Well, I think, you know, thinking about how we, we think about higher education, but also as this possibility or space of liberation. And understanding. That is our hope, that is what we, we want. And I think I’ve come to the realization that wow, that’s an aspiration, I can create laboratory spaces in my community, in my friends and my family, laboratory doesn’t necessarily happen in work, laboratory spaces can happen in solidarity with with, you know, with others, and my sister scholars, my queen group, you know, all of those, all of those groups in my life, you know, the women of color in my life, I think, have really helped just to keep me keep me grounded, but to really validate that my existence is not necessarily entangled with them with the academy and how that validation can come from other places.

Keith Edwards
Yeah, and create got liberation in your home and this relationship and these communities and other ways, which I think also then helps give you the grounding and the healing and the fuel to show up at work in different ways, and perhaps be more grounded well, that perhaps you’re getting feedback that you are grounded, that you weren’t present that you are here for this class, which then makes you more effective at trying to achieve some of the things. So it’s just a reminder me about how we’re letting go a little bit can help us be more effective. Yeah. Right. Right. Yeah, more and more and more and hanging on to it harder and tougher. And,

Susana Muñoz
yeah. And I think what what we don’t realize is when you do let go, it opens up space for other things to come in, you know, other not only just different kinds of ways that you think about your, your time and what you’re spending time on, but just different kinds of opportunities that you never leave thought about that maybe you want to kind of venture on in itself. So yeah, I think I think it’s important to do that assessment every now and then, to just start it. In what ways does this serve me? In what ways? Is this not serve me? And thank it for all the things that it provided in your life and just let it go. Yeah, yeah.

Keith Edwards
Well, just because this thing doesn’t serve me now doesn’t mean it didn’t at one time may have worked one time served me really well and no longer does. Or maybe I have a new awareness or a new relationship. And so I think that can help us let go. What else would you like to share?

Susana Muñoz
Well, I think speaking of letting go, I made the really hard decision of, of stepping away from Student Affairs NOW as the host. And I just want to thank you, in particular, because I think you were really giving me time and space. And even just, you know, saying, you know, whatever you want us to look like we’ll honor that. And I think that just a testament of who you are, but also like the deep friendship that we have. And, and why this was a hard decision is because of you all, like you, Heather Glenn. And the other co hosts, I feel like we you know, we all share this history. Right with each other.

Keith Edwards
I was doing the math, it’s been 25 years.

Keith Edwards
I know. It’s hard not to curse, isn’t it?

Susana Muñoz
Yeah, we still look good. But I think that was the hard part is Do you know, do you all have been, you know, my colleagues, but you know, really good friends over the years. And it’s just really an honor to share the space. And it’s been an honor to also like, see where Student Affairs NOW, you know, is today, and I think when we were coming up with this, I was like, oh, yeah, oh, like, I participate. And I was like, you know, do these podcasts and like a little, you know, pet project that, you know, we can have, and it’s really expanded, and it’s touched so many people, it’s impacted, you know, the way we even bring, you know, podcast information to our classrooms, and even to our meetings, as you know, as required knowledge for us to kind of have deeper conversations about what’s happening on our campuses. And so it’s truly been just an honor and privilege to witness where Student Affairs NOW has flourished and grown since the since the little meeting than the meeting that we had at the beginning. When you’ve asked me to join.

Keith Edwards
Well, I remember in that first conversation that you Heather, Glenn and I had before Raechele and Mamta to join us, but that first conversation you just said very sternly to us. I need this to be restorative to the profession. And like not you weren’t asking. We just said Oh, yes. And that has sort of been something we talked about at the beginning of every episode and is in the essence of what we do, and so really appreciative for that. And yeah, for folks who don’t know, we we meet on Thursday mornings and we laugh, and we’re irreverent and we’re frustrated and we have brilliant ideas and we connect each other with wonderful people who might be great guests. And we talk about parenting and family and the things that we’re navigating. And it’s, it’s, it’s a community. And it’s been great to have you be part of the community and great to have you in connection and we have known each other for a long time. And then we go in different directions and do different things. So it’s been wonderful to, to circle back and connect with you, and wonderful to see you when we got to see you, to our surprise at ACPA. And you were there and to see you. At that time, you were still on your sabbatical, you were very like, but later in the sabbatical and full of emotion, and energy, and just you’re very clear, like, this experience has forever changed me.

Susana Muñoz
Yeah, no, yeah, I remember that. And I think it was just, you know, releasing a lot of unhealthy notions of work and really starting to love and honor my body and my, my soul and spirit and ways that I haven’t in the past, and, you know, how to, you know, be kind to it. And also, you know, let go of some of the shame and guilt. And so I think that took took a while. So I think you caught me at a place where I was at that, in that intersection of like, Yes, I’m, I’m coming out of this, you know, a different person, but I’m still really emotional about, like, what I endured. And so, so yeah, I think that was, that was a good space to kind of run into you all and also kind of share. And, again, it I think, we we share this history. And so any, I think, when we’re always going to be connected, right, because we have this experience when we were in grad school, but we have this experience that of, of this podcast, also. But I feel very connected to to all of you. And I think that’s kind of what was pulling at my heartstrings is that it was you all that provided this, this community that was really nourishing for me at a time where I really needed it. Yeah, yeah.

Keith Edwards
Well, but we want what’s best for you. And it sounds like what’s best for you is stepping away. And we’ve we’ve talked about this. So this is no big surprise, but wonderful to have the episodes that you’ve been able to do, including one of our very first ones around moving beyond land acknowledgments. And I am forever touched by your concluding your conversation with Laura Rendon with you saying sharing, I love you with each other. And as you’re talking about your transformation, and hearing what she has meant to you, it’s just it feels like we’re coming full circle and coming around to that, and your way of being and the possibilities that that’s gonna evoke. And you’re always you’re always welcome back if you get, you know, super energized and a topic or a guest or something like that, we’d love to have you come back and jump in as a hosted share something or offer something, along with folks, but you’ve been here from the very beginning and helped shaped what this is and then continue to shape what it’s become. And we’re just really, really grateful for all the episodes, but also the conversations and the wisdom and the mentoring and guidance you’ve offered us along the way.

Susana Muñoz
I appreciate that. And thank you for, again, just providing the space for me to be by my authentic self and for me to just, you know, show up as you know, in any way that I that I could show up and so super appreciative of the work that you all do. And I hope that and know that you will continue to impact the field and and in make it restorative. Yeah, yeah.

Keith Edwards
Yeah, well, we’re running out of time. The podcast is called Student Affairs NOW. And so we always end with what are you thinking, troubling or pondering now? So what’s with you now?

Susana Muñoz
I think a lot is has been, you know, I’ve been working with him for undocumented students and DACA students, you know, and, and just getting to meet more and more students on my campus and, and I think what I, when I’ve talked to student affairs professionals across, you know, different institutions is I think what I’m what I’m pondering now is what is what is the career pathways look like for folks that, you know, still don’t have a work permit, and so I think those are the issues that keep me up at night. But also like, how can we create more humanizing spaces, you know, for our students on our college campuses. So I know like, right now, higher education, there’s a lot of ways and directions that we’re looking forward to, we can look back to and I think for me, it’s, it’s really about continuing to be in solidarity and community with the community that has really given me a lot of life in and joy in the academy. So, so I continue to just send up a lot of my energy and, and heart into, into those individuals in that community. So that’s kind of where, what I’m thinking about where I’m at. And then I also continue to just, again, we think notions of work and rethink, you know, what is, what is the next chapter for Susana Munoz look like? And so, not that I have that thought out or written, but I feel like, you know, there’s some different ways that I’ve made me think about my career going, yeah, yeah,

Keith Edwards
I’m excited. Whatever it is, I think what it is with me now I’ll share is you you’ve continuously in this conversation, talked about a sabbatical and professorship and scholarship and the work that you’re doing the research, the intellectual, and you have brought so much emotion to it. And you have continually talked about listening and paying attention to your body, and what your body is telling you, and also where your spirit wants to go. And where do you want to connect with? And where do you want to put your energies. And so I really appreciate you bringing sort of all four of those domains. And this notion of, of challenging, what is work is really radical. And, and it’s a wonderful for you. I’m delighted for that as someone who cares about you. But it’s also wonderful role modeling for others. And I think you talked about how your students are doing that. And hopefully this conversation is opportunity, we wanted to give you an opportunity to share about your journey, because I think it’s so been so transformative to you and other faculty who may be thinking about a sabbatical or even some student affairs staff who are starting to have some sabbatical opportunities and possibilities. And I love how you’re, you’re modeling that for all of us.

Susana Muñoz
Do not wait, take it.

Keith Edwards
Yeah. And you know, we’ve had some some we, before we hit record, we were talking about some some people in our lives who are really struggling and are really facing really difficult things. And they’re reminder to not take things for granted. Not take the good things not to take the hard things for granted. So I’m glad you’re you’re moving forward that and I can’t wait to find out what’s ahead for you.

Susana Muñoz
Stay tuned.

Keith Edwards
Yeah, thank you, Susanna. And thanks to our sponsor of today’s episode Symplicity.

Keith Edwards
Symplicity is the global leader in student services technology platforms with state of the art technology that empowers institutions to make data driven decisions specific to their goals. A true partner to the institution Symplicity supports all aspects of student life, including but not limited to, Career Services and Development, Student Conduct and well being student success and accessibility services. Learn more by visiting symplicity.com or connecting with them on Facebook, Twitter, and LinkedIn. As always, a shout out to Nat Ambrosey who does all the behind the scenes work to make us look and sound good. We love the support for these conversations from our community, including you. You can help us reach even more folks by subscribing to the podcast, subscribing to YouTube, or subscribing to our weekly newsletter that announces each new episode, and more. If you’re so inclined, you can also leave us a five star review. It really helps the reach of these conversations. And Keith Edwards thanks again to Susana Munoz today and to everyone who’s watching and listening. Make it a great week. Thank you.

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